---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 08:00:50 -0500
From: Bob Gotwals <gotwals@shodor.org>
To: Chong99@cris.com, EASI@SJUVM.STJOHNS.EDU
Subject: Re: Braille Online
Mr. Chong,
Thank you for your very kind and supportive note. Some replies are
imbedded in your note. I've taken the liberty of copying the EASI group on
this note.
> National Federation of the Blind
> in Computer Science
>_________________________________________________________________
>Curtis Chong, President 20 Northeast 2nd Street
>Phone: 1-612-671-2185 Apartment 908
>Fax: 1-612-671-6615 Minneapolis, Minnesota 55413-2265
>Internet: chong99@cris.com U.S.A.
>
>December 18, 1996
>
>
>
>Mr. Bob Gotwals
>The Shodor Education Foundation, Inc.
>923 Broad Street Suite 100
>Durham, NC 27705
>
>Dear Mr. Gotwals:
>
>I have received your post to the EASI mailing list dated December
>18, 1996; and I thank you for your candor on this subject. You
>acknowledge in a straightforward and no nonsense manner that the
>current design of the Braille Online program makes it difficult for
>blind people to benefit from the course material. I wish that you
>had made this clear in your original announcement so as to mitigate
>some of the criticisms you have doubtless received.
We couldn't agree more, and have modified our online announcement to so
reflect this. Future mailings will absolutely include the appropriate
statement! What a wonderful and useful suggestion. In hindsight this one
should have been a "no-brainer". We consider ourselves to be intelligent
folks, but sometimes common sense doesn't always prevail!
>
>Regardless of whether or not Braille Online will be useful to blind
>computer users, the fact remains that the blind community will be
>better served if more people become proficient in reading and
>writing braille. We, the blind, need teachers of blind children
>who believe in braille and who are competent, both in its use and
>in its teaching. We need more skilled braille transcribers in
>order to increase the number of braille books that we can read.
>Above all, we need more people to believe in the value of braille
>so that all blind children will be schooled in this vital tool of
>literacy. We cannot know today whether any on-line method of
>teaching braille (such as Braille Online) will help to achieve
>these goals, but this should not stop people from trying to develop
>new and innovative ways of teaching braille.
As I may have mentioned, my foundation is NOT in the business of working
for/with the blind or deaf communities. We're doing this work because of
my PERSONAL interest in braille and sign language. I've been doing braille
since I was 7, and it's been a love affair that has gone on now for 35
years. The opportunity to try to incorporate the work I do as a scientist
and technologist with my first academic love was just too good to be true.
I'm disappointed that we weren't more careful about the wording, especially
regarding accessibility. If there is a braille fan club, I'm pushing to be
at the front of the line!
>
>I am not personally convinced that blind people can learn braille
>using audio output alone or, for that matter, any form of on-line
>computerized instruction. Braille is, after all, a tactual "hands
>on" means of reading and writing. Without hard copy braille
>material or a refreshable braille display (which most of us can't
>afford to begin with), how can we realistically expect someone who
>is blind to learn braille?
Concur. We're not sure where technology will take us, so all we can do is
keep our fingers crossed that the technology will move us past the audio.
We had proposed trying to incorporate a refreshable braille display
capability to the course (with the assumption that prices will go down),
but the funding agency didn't or couldn't include that.
>
>Carrying this thinking a bit further, I hope that your
>instructional program will enable sighted participants to actually
>feel the braille which they are learning. Instructional programs
>in which braille is presented only visually (e.g., printed dots on
>the screen or page) fail to reinforce the notion that braille is
>first and foremost something handled by TOUCH!
Most of the folks locally here who helped us test the intro course this
past semester prepared their assignments on Perkins braillers. Most of
them are current VI teachers, so have lots of access to braille materials
in their school (most of our "guinea pigs" were Governor Morehead faculty).
In short, I couldn't agree more. Even as a sighted reader, I use my
fingers.
>
>If I were to make some specific recommendations, they would be as
>follows:
>
>1. I think it is important that your promotional materials
> clarify that Braille Online is not now accessible to the
> blind. You might even take this notion a step further and
> clarify that the target audience for the program consists of
> sighted people who will be teaching or producing braille.
Done.
>
>2. I would not hold out much hope that web browsers will make the
> graphical world more accessible to the blind. Although web
> browsers can and should be made more compatible with screen
> reading systems used by the blind, accessibility to the
> Worldwide Web is more readily achieved if web page designers
> take the time and trouble to ensure that the design of their
> web pages meets basic accessibility guidelines too numerous to
> list here.
>
We have some of those guidelines, and will adhere to them to the maximum
extent possible. We'll also be depending on the community to tell us when
we fail. Within technological feasibility, we'll fix it. I don't share
your feelings about web browsers, however. Perhaps I'm the eternal
technology optimist! After all, didn't Bill Gates say (not too long ago
either), "640K of RAM memory is all anyone will ever need"?
>3. If you haven't considered doing it, provide a way for course
> participants to deal with hard copy braille. Based upon what
> I have read so far, it appears that course participants will
> be producing braille, either with a Perkins Braille Writer or
> a slate and stylus. This is eminently desirable. I wonder
> how you envision having them turn in their braille
> assignments.
Folks who did hard copy braille mailed them to me. Worked fine. Depending
on student load, we'll have local teachers here help with grading and
evaluation. I DID have some folks use a piece of software that emulates a
Perkins brailler. They also had a chance to use a real Perkins brailler.
They were impressed with the similarities in the two. We'll continue to
investigate that phenomenon.
>
>4. I think that some research needs to be conducted specifically
> to determine how on-line computerized instruction
> courses--specifically, courses to teach braille--can benefit
> people who are blind. My initial notion is that no benefit
> can be truly realized unless the course presents information
> both audibly (via synthesized speech) and tactually (via a
> refreshable braille display) at strategic points. You may
> have a different concept in mind. If so, I would like to
> discuss it.
>
Would LOVE to have that discussion. Again, the current design depends
heavily on "photographs", or screen snapshots, of the monitor. On the
monitor is the Perkins-emulator program that I use, which uses a special
braille font. The only way we can think of now to replace those snapshots
is with LARGE audio files. Unless the recipient has a high speed line,
this may be problematic.
>I want to thank you for taking the time to discuss this important
>issue with everyone. I hope that you will not feel personally
>offended by some of the comments you may have received. All of us
>want more blind people reading and writing more braille, and all of
>us want more and better braille instruction and transcription
>services to be available to the blind community. Where we may
>differ is in our respective approaches.
>
I have to admit that the criticism has been difficult. We should have
forseen it better, and I'm mad at myself for that. At the same time, I've
been a braillist and a professional sign interpreter for a long time. A
significant part of my life has been devoted to this work, so it has not
been easy. We're still excited about the work, however, and are determined
to do it right. I concur that we both want more and better braille
instruction, and that is clearly the goal. I'm not sure our approaches are
that far apart....but hopefully we've started down the path of making those
differences disappear.
>Yours sincerely,
>
>Curtis Chong
>President
>National Federation of the Blind
> in Computer Science
>
....many thanks again for your thoughtful, insightful, and instructive
letter. Best wishes for a blessed and restful holiday season. After
perhaps a rocky start, I'm looking forward to a long professional
(electronic) relationship with you and with other EASI participants.
Robert R. Gotwals, Jr.
Computational Science Educator
The Shodor Education Foundation, Inc.
923 Broad Street Suite 100
Durham, NC 27703
gotwals@shodor.org
WWW: http://storm.shodor.org/~gotwals/gotwals.html
(919) 286-1911
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